Some would say that labels only complicate things and cause more division. Okay, maybe in some cases this is true. But in this instance..i.e..where political parties are concerned, if you boil the labels down you're left with certain principles and characteristics.
It is characteristic of conservative-minded people to not be open to new opinions/behaviors. By definition, this would make for at least some close-mindedness, wouldn't it? I think so. Closed to new opinions and points of view? Yes, that falls under close-mindedness.
Conversely, it is characteristic of liberal-minded people to be open to new opinions/behaviors.
So, just sticking to definitions, this seems to fly in the face of the idea that liberals and conservatives are "opposite sides of the same coin," or "birds of the same feather"....that there is really some covert commonality at play, yadda, yadda.
One person on social media put it this way....
If commitment comes from rejection, it means serious thought has gone into this commitment. If commitment comes from tradition, no thought at all has come into it.
This sums is it up pretty well, I think. Sticking with tradition..e.g..if I stick with a principle/value/behavior just because 'That's the way I've always done it!,' this doesn't require any contemplation on my part. I may as well be sticking with tradition for tradition's sake, and this, I contend, is what is taking place a lot of the time nowadays, and it's not only what holds us back as a society, it's what makes our society more dangerous than it needs to be. Less compassion = more potential for danger.
Speaking of society, I'm wondering how a Me, me, me! mindset is conducive to living in a peaceful society? For example, on social media I see one of the current hot topics is health care and the debate on if it's a right or a privilege. The argument that certain people are making is that they shouldn't have to pay for some other person's health needs. Your child has a preexisting condition, do they? Huh. Oh, well. Not my problem.
But yet, if it was their problem, I'm going to venture a guess that they'd surely be fine with getting monetary help from strangers before letting their child die.
So? Why the posturing, then? Why the short-sighted, myopic view, then?
Here's why: Selfishness...aka, me, me, ME! These people? These people live in their own little societies, their own microcosms, and lately I've been trying to figure out what business they have living in a democratic society. There is no room for a bunch of individual societies here. Only narcissists and sociopaths live in their own little societies.
It's ironic, though: These self-serving, compassion-be-damned people would kill each other once they eliminated those whom they view as "snowflakes", which is their "en vogue", pejorative term for those viewed as weak. Yes, because being anything from poor, to compassionate, to non-religious, to non-white, to non-conservative makes you a crybaby in their eyes.
Let's just say that I'm not feeling particularly hopeful for the human race these days.
15 comments:
I find most people don't really think these things all the way through. "That's the way we've always done it" is very dangerous.
I'm Waaaaaaay more liberal now that I've left Christianity (more like I was before I became one). I saw how God had "chosen" ones and that eventually makes it totally justifiable to be me me ME.
I find most people don't really think these things all the way through.
And it doesn't help matters when certain religious philosophies admonish us to not think things through. Remember? Be like little children?
"That's the way we've always done it" is very dangerous.
Yes, it is, because let's face it, there was a point in time when lynching and burning other human beings was the way that folks always dealt with "n*ggers", "witches", and let's not forget non-believers. Fortunately, a few "snowflakes" protested, and things changed.
I'm Waaaaaaay more liberal now that I've left Christianity (more like I was before I became one)
And I'm venturing a guess that it was being liberal-minded in the first place that eventually made the cognitive dissonance unbearable. I mean, if we have an ounce of compassion and empathy, we know that the idea of burning people alive for any reason whatsoever is utterly insane. Especially for.... what?....a thought crime? Absurd.
Even the comparative statements of "opposite sides of the same coin," or "birds of the same feather" are utterly without thought and/or contemplation - they're completely lazy and bankrupt statements.
This is a good post - one that brings up several points that gets me completely flabbergasted on how to put into words because it seems whenever I'm faced with such a person ... it's not that they merely have "conservative" ideas (where I charitably give this a definition of "cautious" and contemplative in their decision making process) ... but rather they bring ZERO thought and consideration to the table! To be called "close minded" is one thing but when I ask what it is that my mind is closed to, the answer is usually some variation of "You're closed to not changing/keeping the status quo or go back to 'the way it use to be'" ... at this point a painful facepalm or headdesk is employed by me as I think, "Back to what?!? Model T cars or hand cranked record players ... actual ice boxes and butter churns?!?"
Yeah - I'm fucking CLOSED to that shit!! Unless you have some extraordinary reasoning for doing so, it's pretty much a given that it's out of the question.
What's worse is, we can't get these "conservatives" to even acknowledge the very real and practical facts of our current state - tax payer money funds things like Libraries, Police, Fire and Roads ... all things we agree are shared and positive and helpful for our mutual benefit for a profitable society ... by their VERY existence these are SOCIALIST programs and services!
When confronted with this, all you get is their exquisite ostrich impersonation where they bury their heads in the sand and you hear a muffled "lalalala Nope"
I'm mystified as to how to even start a useful and meaningful dialogue with these folks with out first completely capitulating every value and position I currently hold
Da Fuq!!
Robert,
I recently overheard a conversation at a family gathering. All democrats kill babies. ALL. OF. THEM. They don't support family planning or offer contraception emergency or otherwise. They don't see the nuances in pro-life vs pro-choice and how it is a spectrum of many factors and situations. They are BABY KILLERS!!!!!!
In the meantime, the same would choose a warmonger over a liberal, because after all the WAR machine doesn't kill innocent babies.
I recently overheard a conversation at a family gathering. All democrats kill babies. ALL. OF. THEM.
This is why I'd make a HORRIBLE front of the house guy. I couldn't bite my tongue, or I'd bleed to death tryin'......::bows to those with nerves of steel:: ;)
They don't see the nuances[...]"
Nuances? NUANCE ?????? What on earth is thAT, Alice??? In the delusional black'n white bubble, there's no middle ground, no exceptions, no extenuating circumstances....nothing. but. black. and. white.
In the meantime, the same would choose a warmonger over a liberal, because after all the WAR machine doesn't kill innocent babies
Hypocricans? lol Thx for the feedback!
EDIT: My bad. I assumed "family gathering" was something overheard @ work. It occurred to me after I posted that it could've been your own family. Either way, I can't bite my tongue! lmao!
... the WAR machine doesn't kill innocent babies
Thankfully we have the determined war machine to keep the GUILTY baby population in check. (Note: intense sarcasm and snark)
Additionally to boomSLANG's point of:
"the delusional black'n white bubble, there's no middle ground, no exceptions, no extenuating circumstances....nothing. but. black. and. white."
I notice that ANY attempt to discuss the evolution (oops, another dirty word) from black to white requires completely re-litigating the ENTIRE known factual case ... and it's a dogfight at every layer and step JUST to get to BEGIN the debate on the next logical step forward
No one's got time for that ... and yet ... it's imperative that we FIND time for that for the benefit of civilization and humanity.
Yeah, I've run into similar situations within my own family
Even the comparative statements of "opposite sides of the same coin," or "birds of the same feather" are utterly without thought and/or contemplation - they're completely lazy and bankrupt statements ~ R. Hall
I agree, but I also find that there's a common denominator with the people who stand by such comparisons, and that common denominator is that these people are trying to level the playing field---that is, they know darned tootin' well that what they espouse has holes and/or is rightfully criticized, but rather than having to actually admit they could be wrong, which could motivate a change from theism to atheism, or from Republican to Democrat, or from Conservative to Liberal, etc., etc., they try to say that those who oppose them are on equally flimsy ground. I liken it to when Christians say, "Oh yeah? Well, atheists have faith too!" Um, no they don't, at least not in the context that theists use "faith". This is plainly a case of people attempting false equivalence, and it's a disingenuous tactic.
And besides, what are theists really trying to say when they say atheists have faith, too? What? Are they saying that their faith is trustworthy and on solid ground, and therefore so is mine? Or are they saying that an atheist's faith is on flimsy ground, and therefore theirs is too? Which is it? And Conservatives? When they say that liberals and conservatives are "birds of a same feather," what are they actually trying to say? That liberals don't give a sh!t about the environment or a child's well-being, and neither do they? This is a ruse that keeps them from having to admit they're actually wrong.
What's worse is, we can't get these "conservatives" to even acknowledge the very real and practical facts of our current state - tax payer money funds things like Libraries, Police, Fire and Roads ... all things we agree are shared and positive and helpful for our mutual benefit for a profitable society ~ R. Hall
Yes, it's interesting, isn't it---they froth at the mouth and turn purple over the thought of their tax dollars helping someone else's health problems. Yes, because, health and health problems should be privatized! Oh, really? Okay, so how about burglar problems, then? Or wait.... how about flame problems? Imagine a conversation that went like this......
Republican hubby: "Honey!?!?!?...call 911!! The kitchen's on fire!!"
Republican helpmeet: "I just tried! They said Danny's Fire Service is closed on Mondays!!!!"
Republican hubby: "D'oh!"
Republican helpmeet: "Maybe we should reconsider the Republican party, dear?"
Republican hubby: "NEVER! Stupid libtards!....::sizzle, sizzle, sizzle::"
No one's got time for that ... and yet ... it's imperative that we FIND time for that for the benefit of civilization and humanity. ~ R. Hall
We'd better make time to talk about it, because think of the time it'll require in the long run in the event that our country is demolished by an atom bomb or nuclear warhead and we have to rebuild it. I know, I know....*why have nukes if you're not going to use them?
*paraphrased from Trump's publicized remarks on the topic.
I find most people don't really think these things all the way through ~ Alice
Exactly. If both sides thought things through and arrived at opposite conclusions or positions, then okay, the "opposite sides of the same coin" idiom might apply. But if one side, by definition, doesn't think things through - for example, because they are sticking with what has "worked" in the past, no further contemplation necessary - then no, the two sides aren't closely related. There is no "coin" common denominator.
My bad. I assumed "family gathering" was something overheard @ work. It occurred to me after I posted that it could've been your own family. Either way, I can't bite my tongue! lmao!
It was actual family.
I've been thinking a lot of things through and the "this is the way it's always been done" thing starts to make less and less sense. It is as if almost no one thinks outside of the "matrix" if you know what I mean. I feel like a weirdo most of the time :P
"I feel like a weirdo most of the time" ~ Alice
I know what you mean - it seems as if we've experienced a lifting of a veil to see things we were blind to and now its preposterous that the folks around us who are still blind to these things can't see them. Things to use seem so obvious that it seems virtually impossible for those veiled with religion to not see them and yet they simply refuse to even LOOK
I feel like a weirdo most of the time :P
Oh, I feel ya. I'm thankful that with the advent of the World Wide Web, we weirdos, people who would likely never cross paths in real life, can connect and share stories. I mean, you're like a gazillion miles away, and yet, we "bumped" into each other online. Or for that matter, we could feasibly live on the same block and never know each other's stories. Pretty cool havin' a place to weird-out together, 'n junk =P
and now its preposterous that the folks around us who are still blind to these things can't see them.
Right? I confess that it makes me want to pull my hair out at times. Elephant in the living room? Uh, no.....an entire herd of them! But alas, from within the believer's bubble they can't or won't recognize what's so obviously there(to us) because those elephants have been hidden, much in the same way that David Copperfield hides a Boeing 747 with mirrors. A fitting analogy, perhaps, since there is essentially a desire for "magic" to be real. If you know how the trick's done, it's not as fun anymore.
:)
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