Thursday, May 19, 2016

Who Ya Gonna Call?








Okay, suppose that you want to know more about, say, anti-lock braking systems. Do you consult an auto mechanic? Or do you consult a botanist?

How about if you want to learn which snakes are venomous and which are harmless? Do you phone up a herpetologist, or a seamstress?

Suppose that there's a Hindu and a Mormon sitting at the bar and you want to know what Hindu's believe. Do you ask the Hindu, or do you ask the Mormon?

I think most of us get the picture. I found the above meme on Facebook. 'Dollars-to-doughnuts a Christian whipped up this little gem of a meme. How can I tell? Okay, well, it's full of misinformation, red herrings, and generally just plain idiotic rhetoric, and we see this sort of thing being perpetuated by the far Christian Right these days. So, that's how I can tell that a Christian whipped it up.

So, Christians, if you genuinely(key word) want to learn more about what we atheists do or don't believe, then I suggest that you ask someone who's actually an atheist. It only makes sense, doesn't it? I think so. Seriously, you really need to cease and desist from projecting onto atheists, and it would be nice if you would stop getting your information on what atheism entails from other theists. Please, just stop it.

With that little request out of the way, please know that it is secularists who believe that there should be a church/state separation. In other words, not all secularists are atheists. Please stick that in your memory bank, Christians.

Now, as far as those who believe that one's religion "should be behind closed doors", again, this isn't solely atheists who advocate this. No. Because if one's religion happens to be, say, Islam, then you can bet the farm that Christians want that sh*t hidden behind the church Mosque doors. In fact, many(most? nearly all?) Christians don't even tolerate the Mosques, themselves, never mind what goes on inside them.

Of course, I don't want to sit here and resort to the very same sorts of tactics that I decry and turn around and generalize. For that reason, I need to be clear: Certainly not all Christians advocate the lovey-dovey parts of the bible, exclusively. No. In fact, very recently I encountered a few Christian bloggers who argue that other Christians who extol God as the "God of Love" have it the wrong way around. To them, the Christian deity is way more about things like "justice" and "wrath".... grrrrrrrr.  See, their rendition cherry-picked version of "God" gets its jollies creating human beings just so that he can turn around and torture most of them mercilessly for all eternity. It "pleases Him", they say. In their eyes(and according to their blog), doing so is an example of God's *"Perfect Justice".

*except when their "God" is feeling "Gracious", then "Perfect Justice" becomes "selective justice".

Anyway, about one's sex life being paraded down the street, yadda, yadda. Again, this is a feeble attempt on the part of some Christians to demonize all atheists. Maybe some atheists don't mind one's sexuality being paraded around town; maybe some do mind it. Either way, what most atheists who've read the bible can probably agree on is that the bible gets the Adult Video AwardXXX for explicitly lewd and lascivious behavior. Let's see, there's the instance of two sisters getting their father drunk and taking turns with him in the sack. But that's somehow not nearly as offensive as two same-sex people holding hands in public, right? Which would you have a harder time explaining to a child? I think I'd have a harder time explaining the former.

In closing, for those of you Christians who are getting your information on atheism from your churches, from your favorite Christian websites, and from each other, please just stop it. If you have questions about what atheism entails, you can ask those questions here, or if you wouldn't dream of asking a question here because of my "trashy", direct approach, fair enough, you can find the "Friendly Atheist" blog and ask him. But posting memes like the one above just tells me and other atheists that you're not really interested in what atheists believe and that preserving your beliefs will always take precedence over reality, even if it means lying. You know who you are and you fool no one.

10 comments:

Robert said...

And then there's Ezekiel 23 - so graphic it would make porn stars and directors blush! To be a fly on the wall for THAT lesson in Sunday school for the kiddies.

There's a double standard they use when we say we want their religion out of public schools and government ... they interpret it as "keep it hidden/behind closed doors etc. But they never quite seem to realize that if THAT is what we secularists ACTUALLY meant - that would mean No Bibles in book stores, not religious themed trinkets for sale in jewelry stores, no more advertising in news papers and billboards, and ANY identifying architecture/artwork including signage on their churches etc. ... now THAT would be forcing it behind closed doors and out of sight of the public (you know - like Xians want followers of Islam to do)

We've NEVER even insinuated THAT level of scrubbing the entire social public landscape of their religion - far from it. As far as I know, in this country (US) no one has EVER asked the religious folk to "hide" their religion of not "show" it publicly - WBC perhaps one of the most odious cults has always been free to parade their "beliefs" up and down the street without interference ... their problem was always when that wasn't good enough but they felt that right to publicly protest gave them carte blanche to disrespect other citizens and restrict THEIR rights ... and that's what it all boils down to - Religious folk NEED the right to trample the rights of others and force those people to submit to their beliefs - no questions asked. And THAT is about the most ANTI American idea ever.

boomSLANG said...

Well said.

"But they never quite seem to realize that if THAT is what we secularists ACTUALLY meant[....]"

IOW, you're both an atheist and a secularist. I'm only mentioning it because that's the case with me, too. But theists, particularly Christian theists, like to conflate the two things when those two things are not mutually inclusive. Many Deists are also secularists. In fact, a few of the Founding Fathers were both Deist and secularist. They might've believed in "God", sure, but they were wise enough to know that if any one religion were to be established as the "State" religion, it would be disastrous. This is why I roll my eyes when I read how Christians think we're a "Christian Nation" and go on to say that we need to go back to biblical rule/biblical values. Please, enough already. Cut the crap and read some actual history. Sheesh!

Robert said...

Concur with your follow up ... additionally, I'd argue the majority of christians (moderates/liberals claiming that sect) are ACTUALLY deists in practice ... their cherry picking and cortorted "interpretations of scriptures points to this - in fact MANY christians outright reject a large majority of scripture for one reason or other and then when asked to "defend" their beliefs they retreat to the farthest reaches of the most nebulous attributes of what they call "god" which is effectively the deist god ... they KNOW most of the bible is bunk and they cede MANY passages while claiming the name on the cover is all that REALLY matters ... like trying to nail jello to a wall ... can't be done :P

FYI - unrelated - talked to our mutual friend LV - will try to schedule to bring him out to practice next time he's in town :)

boomSLANG said...

"they KNOW most of the bible is bunk"

Well, they know much of the bible is unpalatable and/or outdated. I somehow can't envision them calling it "bunk":) But no, they'd come up with something else for the unpalatable parts, you know, like calling it "metaphor", or "parable", or "the Old Law". Stuff like that.

As far as those you mention being deists in practice, I think I get where you're coming from, but I would say that the ultra liberal crowd fall more under Universalism than deism. If nothing else, for the simple fact that the former still believe in a personal "God"..e.g..a god who answers prayer, intercedes, is the basis for morality, etc. Deists on the other hand don't believe in a god who does any of that. At least, to the best of my recollection they don't.

LV obviously told you he's been out once, I take it. Yeah, we peeled his eyelids back. lol

Robert said...

My dislike for typing always gets me into trouble in these types of discussions because I take short cuts and economize my points ... and in fairness, due to my advance age, I brainfart words occasionally so it becomes necessary to talk around particular point where the word(s) have fled to the less active parts of my inner cranium :P

I KNOW they wouldn't actually call it "bunk" - that was shorthand for them knowing that literally every animal did not embark on a world cruise and the whole "7 Days to World Creation for Dummies" didn't "quite" happen as the narrative outlines. The vast majority of Xians make no attempt to defend these as viable claims of absolute, literal truth.

I guess it's more accurate to say that I was trying to say that they revert to defending a hybridized version of the Deist-type god while holding as many of their preferred cherry-pick attributes - like gay bashing, slut shaming, god loves me but not you, he answers my prayers not yours etc. and whatnot. I know the deist god does none of that - but since we can actually test prayer response/therapy and things that one would expect to see some - shall we say, unexpected/unexplained results, they retreat to the areas that we cannot test - yet to form their defensive perimeter - i.e. the spark of life for the first replicating cells, the catalyst of the big bag itself etc. ... more deist-esque concepts as I've come to understand.

In other words - we're on the same page - you just say it better :P

LV did not tell me he had been there already - but then when I say I "talked" to him - I meant via social media - where conversations are ultra economized to fundamental facts/ideas ... ok .... I'll stop digging my grave deeper at this point - oh me oh my :D

boomSLANG said...

"I KNOW they wouldn't actually call it 'bunk'"

I know you know they wouldn't call it that. Only bustin' your chops a lil' bit :)

Robert said...

Hook, line and sinker .... yaprickya :P

boomSLANG said...

=P

Notabarbie said...

Again, excellent! I love it when someone can be hilarious and hard-hitting at the same time.
It's always pretty funny when I drag out Old Testament stories for the Christians. Many have no idea what is in there, some think I'm making shit up, and others pull the whole, "That's the Old Testament. It doesn't pertain to today" rationalization. Then I'm forced to explain the whole "God is the same yesterday, today, and forever" and "When you've seen me, you've seen the Father" scenario, which always goes well, btw. I forgot how much I enjoyed your blog!

boomSLANG said...

Thx for droppin' by!!! But yeah, it's hard for me to not incorporate humor (or point out irony) considering the type of material I have to work with. Oh, well, gotta git back in the kitchen. I'm bakin' me a loaf of bread and I don't want my dung fire to go out!(Ezekiel 4:12) =P